Building Trust and Simplifying Stories Strengthens Public Relations Strategies

This is straight straight straight out of Crumpton with your host, Greg Crumpton. Good afternoon, everybody. Welcome to another episode of Straight Out of Crumpton. I am Greg Crumpton coming to you today from a slightly overcast and rather cool Greenville, South Carolina. So today, guys, is the, first day after my book has been released into the wild. So yesterday, twelve fifteen twenty four, the, Deep Knowledge book hit the market. So, if you haven't yet, get yourself all over to Amazon or Barnes and Noble and pick up a copy. I sure would appreciate it. So there you go. I got my advertisement out of the way. And now, while you tuned in anyway, was to learn about some, unique factors about people, places, and things. And today, I am bringing you a young lady that I met a few months ago that I think you're gonna really enjoy hearing from. Her name is Samantha DeRose. She is the VP at the McCray Agency out in Phoenix slash Tempe, Arizona. Always wondered if it's Tempe or Tempe. But, anyway, Samantha is joining us. So, Samantha, welcome to the show. Thank you. Thank you for having me. And I that is my first hearing about your book, so I cannot wait to go pick up a copy. Well, I I wanted to surprise you because I know that you just sit around curious about what Crumpton's doing all the time. So I gave you a little surprise. So Always doing something. I love it. I love to see it. Well, hey. Why don't you kick us off? Give us a little bit of background about you. Tell us if it's Tempe or Tempe or how you pronounce that. And how in the world did you wind up at somewhere as cool as the McCray agency? And maybe a little bit about that. Sure. So I guess to answer your first question, it is tempe. Tempe. Tempe. Is that right? Okay. Got it. So, gosh, a bit about me. So I guess I'm one of those rare birds that actually is working in the field that I studied in college. So I went to Arizona State University in Tempe, Arizona. And I started college when I was just seventeen years old. My junior year of high school, mapped out a plan with my advisor and ended up taking some online classes in addition to my full studies at Fountain Hills High School. And, I ended up walking with that class that year, my junior year. And then from there, I ended up going straight to ASU WP Carey School of Business where I studied communications. Well, you know you know, that's funny because I graduated from high school at seventeen also, but I think I graduated so they wanted to get rid of me, not because I was doing so well in advancing. So we we have a little bit in common, but not for the right reasons. Yeah. So you were a young one in college too. People love to tease me about that, how young I was. When I remember going to get my dorm keys, everyone could go and sign for themselves. They were all eighteen, and I had to have my parents walk with me to every station and cosign with me on everything. I was just so embarrassed. But yeah. So from there, I, of course, was in the business school. So I started taking marketing classes, some creative writing classes, and I just really kind of fell in love with marketing and writing. I already knew I liked writing. So from there, I added a minor in public relations and strategic communications. And basically by yeah. My junior year of college, I would say I kind of figured it out and knew that I wanted to go work at a PR firm once I graduated. So when that time came, when I was looking to graduate, I started looking for internships and, you know, full time entry level positions. And that is how I stumbled upon the McCray agency and Beth McCray, the CEO there. And I just remember I originally wasn't going to go to that interview because I was going to apply to be an intern and not an entry level position just yet. But I was graduating, and I felt like, oh, I've already had internships. I don't know. Is it worth it to do another internship? But I ended up going anyway. And me and the person who was interviewing me at the time, their PR account manager, we just clicked and had a really great interview. And so much so that that later that week, I got an email asking if I would be interested in a full time position at the agency as a PR associate instead of an intern. So I was obviously so happy that I ended up that I went and did the interview. And from there, I ended up meeting with Beth, and just kind of the rest is history. Little over eight years later, I'm still here, still loving the agency. And now I'm the vice president, working alongside Beth to lead the agency and, you know, our client relations and our strategies and truly, like, just it's just been such a whirlwind. Beth has been the best mentor I could have ever asked for. I think everyone in the Scottsdale area, maybe even beyond, kind of know her. And she's just really shaped me into who I am as a PR professional, business professional, and just has given me built really built me up. And so I love it. And now I'm doing that to all of our new PR associates, hoping that I can make that same kind of impression on them. Well, that I love that. You know, when you get to work alongside someone who is involved in your career, involved in you, and actually gives a crap about you and your life. Man, what what a tremendous blessing that is. Yeah. Yeah. So many people, Samantha, they have to go outside of their work to find their their career mentor, just because of of life. You know? Everybody like, you had the fortunate experience of clicking with Beth right off. A lot of people don't have that. So there there it's almost like they're living this duplistic life where they go to work and they they trudge through, and then they have this wild horse running inside of them that they don't get to exercise at work all the time. And then they meet with their mentor and they get fired up and they're, you know, super jazzed, and then they go back to work. You know what I mean? It's like Yeah. Like, they just wanna break free. And, I I worked in a situation like that one time where I had such this this passion for for doing what I thought we were capable of doing. And, this dude I work for, he just couldn't get out of his own way, really, and and he was holding up a bunch of us. And there were probably, you know, a double handful of us that wanted to really makes make things happen and and and grow and, you know, expand. But he was such a, I I can't even use the right terminology. This may be censored by the FCC, so I won't use the wording. But, eventually, everybody found their own way. But, god, it it was so tough and, you know, having having to work for somebody that just couldn't just didn't get it. And for you to be able to do that, man, that's that's a special treat. It really is. It like, working with people who you genuinely care about and trust and you wanna see you know, there's we're competitive, but it's a fun competitive. We're always building each other up, and it's, yeah, it's such a privilege. I I totally get that. Well, you you didn't hit the record, but you you came fairly close to our record of using the word trust at the onset of the podcast. Because so many times, that word just bubbles up in our initial conversations because when people are working with people that they do trust, they wanna talk about it. Because it's so, I don't know what what it is about it, but when we when we're working with people that are in our trust circle, circle of trust, if I could steal that phrase, it is, you know, you wanna talk about it because it's exciting. And I think that trust and then you tell me, because we you and I met through one of your customers, ECM Technologies. And, my company, we we support what they're doing. So we're we're a partner with them, and they're they're your client. And you and I met through one of the events. And trust is everything when you're dealing with your customer because, a, they have it in you. They're looking at you to take care of them. You know? Like, okay. You know? Almost like, alright, mom. What do I do? And then if there's nine trust there, it's a weird relationship, and it it's kinda like, you know, it's a little bit cringey. And, you know, watching how you interacted with the ECM team, I could tell y'all had it. It looked like it was clicking. Yeah. Absolutely. They I mean, they're a wonderful client. Shameless plug, ECM Technologies, Thermacleer. They it's, yeah, it's that trust. It's the relationships. And, really, this is kinda what we talked about a little bit prior is how relationships are really the foundation of everything we do Yep. In life and business and certainly public relations because it's all about the people. Understanding them, connecting with them, and building that trust over time. So you've nailed it. Yeah. You know, that I always think about, and I don't know how to be in a relationship that's just transactional because I'm not really good at that. I'm either really good at relationships or I really suck. You know? It's like, I don't just have an okay relationship with many people. I either had a really good one or I have none at all. And, it would be difficult, and it has been difficult for me as a as a business person over the years to have relationships with clients that are just transactional. You know, everybody does have them because they're just part of the the normal, you know, business cycle. But the ones that you really get to engage in and you learn, you know, their their mission and what they're really after, and they they trust you to help them get there, you know, whether for you it's PR and marketing and branding. In my case, it's it's, you know, air conditioning or heat rejection or whatever. But I just find it so fulfilling when somebody says, alright, Crumpton. It's yours. Handle it. You know? It's like, I don't know what it is. It's some kind of weird feeling. Like, yes, it's trust, but it's also like your family to them. You know what I mean? Do you do you have similar things like that that happen? Yeah. Absolutely. And and like you said, when you have a client and this doesn't happen a hundred percent. I mean, it's a it's a majority of the time where you really understand and love their mission and what they're doing, like ECM Technologies, for example. What they're doing for sustainability and for the HVAC world, it's just it's an easy thing to get behind because they're doing it for the greater good in addition to all the other stuff. So, yeah, it's it's really great when you believe in that mission, and then you get to really be the storyteller for their mission. Because I think, you know, a successful PR strategy isn't just putting out some press releases or some campaigns. It's really built on those meaningful connections and building that trust. And in industries like HVAC, where customers may not fully understand maybe that all the technical details or it's a new product like Thermoclear where we're having to educate. I think it gets really fun because we get to make that connection through the buying and lined articles we're writing, through the interviews and, you know, publications like ACHR News, or maybe it's like the business journal. Whatever it may be, we're working to build that trust, build that interest, and be the storyteller for our clients so that we can kind of further explain that technical innovation and show what that brand is doing. So I yeah. I love it. That's probably the best it's the most fun part of the job, taking that creative writing, taking that storytelling, and making the connections and building relationships and trust. How this is something that just popped into my head, which is kinda scary for both of us, I'm sure, at this point. But, what how hard is it for you to represent or or to be the the storyteller or the story creator for a product in an industry like HVAC that you did not study? You know, it's it's relatively new to you. I'm sure. How do do you have to immerse a little bit and and and study, of the, study the field a little bit before you get a feel for it? Or are there just natural points, you know, you have to hit in your messaging? How how does that work? Like, I think about, okay, if I'm going to an article on, selling real estate, I don't you know, what my natural reaction would be is to, okay, I need to spend some hours and dig into it, you know, to to kind of get a feel for it. Do you have to do that, or are actual things that you know to hit regardless of the industry you're representing? I think it's a little bit of both, but I definitely love diving in and being that thought leader because we're the ones that are ghostwriting all the by lines and answering the interview questions. And so to do that, I need to put on my Michael Daley hat. What he's you know, he's the engineer. So the first couple articles, we co wrote so I could kinda see how he wrote about the product and about oil fouling and the terms he used. And just so that I could understand it from his technical brain. And then you but then I have to make it more user friendly. You know? I always have to dumb it down a little bit so that that we're finding more of the story and more people can understand it. But I'm definitely I mean, I'm subscribed to all of the HVAC trade publication newsletters. I'm deaf I'm reading those daily. I'm seeing what's placed in print. I'm definitely diving in to become an expert and to learn about the industry that I write in. I had done this previously. We have another client, Solitude International. And they are these tubular skylights. They have a commercial and residential side. I know them well. I had them in my in my last office. We put them in. Oh, really? Yes. They're I mean, they're amazing. And so when Solitude has actually been a client of the agency since nineteen ninety five. So when I joined the agency, they were already a client and had that relationship. And so I just had to kinda jump on board. And and now it's actually kind of crazy how much I know about the different daylighting fenestration types and how you balance them with a glazed one, with tubular daylighting because they ended up we ended up working with their parent company now, Kingspan Light and Air, which has even more blazing and fenestration options. And so I write all those technical bylines on daylighting too, in doctor Neil Deigert's place. And so I had some practice with them. That was probably the first client where I really had to dig in and become that expert in commercial daylighting and architectural types. And I just absolutely loved it. I think it's one of kind of my specialties that I bring to the agency because I do a lot of those thought leadership writing pieces. I love doing research, and I read studies so that I can back them up in the by lines. And, basically, when we started working with ECM Technologies, I did what I learned through Solatube and started doing that for the HVAC industry. Alright. So you just confirmed my suspicion. You're a closet geek. Okay. I'm good with that because I am too. I know. I'm a I love learning new things. I mean, I just learned that one of our clients is now going into the water side. So I'm like, oh, I need to start becoming an expert on all things commercial water laws and how commercial projects can rain you know, do rainwater harvesting. And all so it's like, oh, that's my next expertise I get to learn about twenty twenty five that's that's coming down the line. Your next foray into the sciences? Yeah. All of a sudden, I'm this ex secret expert in all of these random things I love to, you know, pull out and share with people when I'm like, do you know oil family? Well, you know, going thinking about the ends the, solar solar I can't remember the tube. But Solar tube. Yeah. So so we had this office. It was really a cool office, but, unfortunately, it was, on either side, it had offices. So the only windows that were in it were on the front and then one on the back because we took a garage door out and made a window. But in the core of the space, it was kind of like you lived in a cave. So, I worked with our our architect and we put in, I think, I wanna say six or eight of them so that the folks that were in the middle of the space had daylight, you know, because it can be so inclusive or or enclosing, I guess, is a better term, that you just feel like you're in this cave when you don't see any daylight. Yeah. It's so bad for your brain. Sorry. Well, that's what I was gonna ask you. What are the scientific, pieces of that? How does the bring in natural light endorse, how does that affect you working and thinking and living? It kind of affects it all. So even just starting with your circadian rhythms, like, you need to have that morning daylight so that your body knows to wake up. It know it tells you when to go to sleep at the end of the night. It's helping with your mental health, your physical health. I mean, Solatubes block out the rays that produce vitamin d. But if you have a different type of lasing that still brings those waves in, then you're also getting the vitamin d. It's been shown in studies that having good natural light reduces eye strain, reduces headaches. People just feel happier, more productive. Daylighting because nurses need to stay alert and stay, you know, just on their toes. And so daylighting helps in those spaces. And education is a huge educational facilities is another huge spot because the test scores, they did testing on students in naturally day lit, rooms versus who didn't have sunlight in their room. And the students that were in rooms with sunlight were scoring better on their test scores. They were absent from school less days. And I forget some of the other findings, but it's really incredible how much natural light can do for your bottle body bottle. Jeez. Your body. The physical. Maybe you need a bottle to help you. Yeah. Maybe maybe you need a bottle too. Well, that that I mean, it makes total sense. If you look at people where people live, you know, if you live in parts of the world where it's not daylight often during certain periods of the year, those folks struggle with a lot of depression. So it makes makes total sense. I mean, even here in Phoenix, they're great for the home because windows can bring so much heat into the space, but Solitude blocks out all of those infrared the wavelengths that you don't wanna have. So you can have them in your kitchen, and there's no heat coming out of them cold in in the winter. Not that it gets that cold here. So for things like that too, they're leaning on, you know, the cutting edge energy efficient side of innovation for daylighting. And that's how I kinda think of ECMT is for the HVAC industry. You know, that I'm I'm still I'm I'm gonna have to call you one day. We'll have to redesign my kitchen. Maybe it needs more light in it, but we'll work on that. That's a separate project. We'll have to do that. That would be fun. And then we can definitely we'll take some before and afters, maybe get I was gonna say get you on TikTok, but we don't know the state of TikTok. It's not looking good. So we'll get you on Well, it is not. Unless they do what they should do, which is sell it to a US US backed organization and be done with it. But, anyway, that's a whole another topic. Yep. And speaking of whole another topics, I did hear today where, the new president-elect is going to push for the, the locking of the clock, so to speak, so we won't have the daylight savings time, change twice a year. And you guys don't participate in that anyway. Yeah. We don't. So it's always so confusing here in Phoenix. Like, am I on California time right now? Am I on Yeah. Because sometimes you're two hours behind me, and sometimes you're three. So I always just have to I I keep my world clock set for Phoenix. I always know what time it is there since I have a few friends. So, alright. So I don't know how in the world we got off on daylighting, but I love that. It's it's more knowledge we're dropping for our our crowd that's hungry to learn. So, alright. Give me your definition of or a statement of marketing versus branding. Marketing versus branding. You mean marketing versus, like, public relations? Because we're a PR firm or You know, people like, let let's say you go to a trade show, and people are handing out, the ever present water bottle. And it's got, let's just call it the McCray agency logo on it. Mhmm. And you're giving those away to all the all the willing participants that walk up to your table. Is that marketing, or is that branding? So that's your marketing. But the design on it, that cohesive design, the consistent messaging, you're using your brand colors, and all of that is the branding that you're using in your marketing. And the marketing strategy for the trade show would be putting out those water bottles. Because always, you know, I hear a lot of people intertwining those words. And I I understand the difference, I think. You know, to me, marketing is a verb, and branding is what you are verbing, so to speak. So that's how I look at it. And I'm I'm not studied at all in your field, which is why I find it so fascinating of how, businesses, a, how they decide who they wanna partner with for their PR, their their or their marketing, you know, their their face to the public, so to speak. Always find that interesting of how they make those choices. And and then, you know, we, as people who run businesses like, I know a lot about air conditioning. I don't know squat about marketing except what I've learned the hard way Yeah. Of, what worked and what didn't work and and continuously finding that out, whether it be what post, you know, worked and people like the post to put out on a on a whatever or, you know, it's it's always like I'm doing this homeboy market research to see what works. And But that's good. That's what you kinda have to do. You know? You have to try things, study the analytics, learn what's working. If it's not working, you adapt, adapt the messaging, adapt the creative. So, no, you're doing it. Right? I Well, you know, I've always been broke as a as a as a in my marketing budget. It's always been slim. So I've always had to be creative just out of necessity, but I also like it. I I love coming up with stuff to try. You know? Like and and I've got a couple of start ups that I'm that I am part of. And it's always amazing to me to see what works and what doesn't work. And when people click on stuff and their comments. I just I find it fascinating that, you know, you can put out a post that has, let's just say, a twelve word sentence or statement, and twelve people will comment twelve different things because it hit them differently. I just I find that amazing. Yeah. I I do too. And I I actually had a note to talk about you and what you do on LinkedIn because I feel like you're an expert communicator. You're great on LinkedIn. You're definitely a thought leader in your space and kind of pulls it all back to that relationship building. I witnessed it firsthand, the you know, helping us out through your relationships, the connections you've built. And I feel like you're, like, that firsthand witness of how to be a correct thought leader on LinkedIn and build relationships. I love what you post and seeing all that engagement. I I appreciate it. It it's, I've been on LinkedIn for nineteen years. I worked the other day because somebody asked me when I started posting on LinkedIn. And, it was funny when we first started doing it because one one of the young ladies who I used to work with, Sarah Clark Hopper, She's still a dear friend, and and, hopefully, Sarah will listen to this. But when she first got out of college, we hired her at my company, and she was doing business development for us and selling maintenance agreements. And, she was doing well, and we first started on LinkedIn together. And I remember us having this internal competition to see who could get one hundred connections first. When I think about now, you know, how how long ago that was, a, and some of the people that I've met on LinkedIn are now, like, in real life friends. It's a great tool if if if you use it right, and and that means I don't know what because using it right is kind of like that's my narrative of how to use it right. Other people find it different. You know, some people squawk on there if you post anything personal. This is not Facebook. Yada yada yada. You know, whatever. But it's a freaking public platform. You can you can do and post what you want to on it, you know, within their guidelines. But it's an interesting, swath of of human personalities because it I I just I love the I love the different perspectives people bring to LinkedIn. And that to me is like the ultimate proving ground for a concept. You know? Like, if I've got something I want to talk about for Service Logic, I can do that. If I wanna talk about Adam Power, I I can do that. Gravity, these little companies that I'm involved with in some degree. Or if I just wanna put out that I've got a new book out, you know, it's kind of your playground to experiment. And that's what I do with my postings is to see, you know, what time of day works. Yeah. Is people like people tend to like more, for for me, more people centric post, what's going on with our people at the company or, you know, just I don't know. It's just fun. Do do you mess around with it much, or are you is it strictly a business tool? How how do you use it? You know, I could be better in my personal space of using it. It it's funny. It needs to be one of those I I need to practice what I preach because it can really be useful. And the way you're using it in such an authentic way and you're forming those connections to where you've like you said, you've built these genuine connections online, and now some have even been taken offline. And so people are interested in what you have to say. So when you're sharing small updates, they're they're engaged, that you're talking about the industry, they they wanna hear what you have to say. You're a thought leader in the space. And then when you have something like your new book, where now it's that little bit of promotional. Because what we like to say in social media, we call it the seventy, twenty, ten rule. You wanna be seventy percent informational, you know, providing thought leadership, maybe how tos, sharing your expertise to teach someone, solve their problem. And then there's the twenty percent. That's the emotional side, and companies can then share their mission, their values in that. And then the ten percent is the directly being promotional. And so you wanna weave those in to the messaging. And so you've done that so well is where you built these genuine connections. People are interested in what you have to say, and they're so comfortable with what you're posting and being reading and engaging in it that when you then promote that ten percent, the promotional about your book, they're also engaging with that because they want to support you. They want to see more of what you have to say. And so you built up your social media in such a perfect way that when you then post about something like your book that you want to maybe get some sales in, it doesn't seem that it's not authentic. And so, yeah, you're doing it just right. You're kinda following the the the rules that we kinda have behind. I've never I've never heard that, the seventy twenty ten. Yeah. It's I mean, it's it depends on the industry, but it's just like a quick little rule. No. I mean, it makes sense when I just wrote that down where I could look at it later. But, yeah, that's cool. Well, well, I'm glad I'm hitting the mark. I didn't know there was a mark, but I'm glad I'm hitting it. Yeah. You you definitely are. And You know, again, my my my thesis of anything has to be real. I can't I can't throw BS up because I don't support BS. I try not to spread BS. So People can tell. They can tell when you're not being authentic. And there used to be this space where everything was so perfectly curated and kind of, you know, like, for Instagram, for example. It was like this curated perfect aesthetic that everyone achieved to be, but now people are looking for more of that authentic side, the real side, the behind the scenes. And that's so that they have something to connect with. Well, if you and I have met in person, so you know that, there's nothing curated about this. I'm just gonna go by the bones walking around. Yeah. I tried to request some questions ahead of time, and you were like, nope. It's a free flowing conversation. I'm like, oh, jeez. Well, look. I mean, think about it. If if I gave you a list of questions to talk about instead of what we're doing I mean, I mean, yeah, it it could be fine, but it could damn sure be boring. So Agreed. The planner in me died a little bit because I am so like, I love to be prepared and but We you know what's funny, Samantha? Me too. I'm I love control and and processes, and this is the one space where I really don't do that. I I mean, like, my wife laughs at me because I put everything in my calendar. Like, if I'm going to run errands, you know, I've got, like, seven half hour increments of what I'm going to get done that day. Yeah. Which is like, you're such a moron. But I'm like, that's how that's how my brain works. Yeah. But when I'm able to to take this this forty five minutes or an hour out of out of the day and just let it flow a little bit, I find and I don't know how you are about your creative side, but I get kind of refreshed on the creative side when I let my brain ramble a bit outside of the calendar thirty minute blocks. I don't know if that's just me or if other people do that as well. Yeah. No. I agree. I mean, sometimes, is it crazy to say sometimes you gotta even plan plan for those brainstorm free sessions. And I'm okay. During this time to this time, I'm just coming up with concepts, ideas. You have to because you don't block it out on your calendar. You'll never do it. Yeah. That's true. I mean, I there's a lot of calendar blocks I put down for that I've just got it blocked. It says g in the office. And that means, I get up here and I get to I get to do what I need to get done. You know what I mean? And let me start on something and and and pivot, but I'm I'm in the moment and I'm getting my stuff done and it's flowing. You know, I'm not, answering company emails or, you know, I've got a lot of friends and coworkers across the country, different time zones. So, you know, I get weird stuff at weird times. But when I block out that g office time, it's just like, okay. This is your playground. Yeah. I agree on the same way. Well, my mother was redheaded, so we do have that in common. She was. She was. She was a little five foot nothing, little Bantam rooster acting lady. So exactly me. You know what's funny? Side side rant is growing up, it's my dad's from Italy and my mom's from Iran. So when you look at them and look at me, especially next to my mom, she looks very Middle Eastern, very Persian looking. People will be like, is that your daughter? Do you dye her hair? And my older sister, I have one sister, would always tease me and be like, you're adopted, this and that. And then she ended up having twins. And what did she have was a little girl, brunette, looks just like her, and a little boy, redhead, looks just like me. So y'all got that that DNA floating around your gene pool. Yeah. It it jumps around because other than that, it was my great grandmother on my mom's side, my Persian side who actually had the red hair, blue eyes. Alright. So I've got a friend who is Iranian is what I would call him, but he says he's Persian. Yeah. Tell me tell me that. What is there a cultural thing to to say Persian versus Iranian, or is it a political thing? People don't wanna say it. I mean, what what is the proper tell tell me tell me the history of that. It's a question I should know the answer to. I'm like And you will tomorrow. What? And you will tomorrow. Right. Yeah. I know. I'll immediately text my mom and be like, explain this. So because I know okay. For example, I'm not Persian, but my mom's Persian from where she lived and grew up in Iran. But I would be considered Iranian Okay. And not Persian. But I forget exactly where and how those differ. More cultural than than than than a border. I think it's both. I think it's also, like, where because she actually lived there in certain parts to where she would be considered Persian. But I'm That that does make sense because I've talked to people that like, I've got a good friend. He's Russian. And, you know, they have these, ethnic group areas, like, within I mean, Russia is a pretty big place, but different sets of of, you know, where where your people are from. They kinda live in these groups, so to speak. And I think that it's a communal thing as well as geography. So that I mean, that kinda makes sense to me. But I've all often wondered that, when he's identifying himself, he does my my other friend, from Iran says he's Persian. So I just was curious. I'm And it's, like, where she lived during the time she lived there too in Iran during, you know, the whole Shah time. So, yeah, I don't I can't give you a clear, but Well, is you get the gist. I I think it's so cool that we, as a country, are a melting pot of people. You know, I really do. And that's why, you know, I'm I'm all for immigration, done the proper way because we all came from somewhere. You know? It maybe not your generation or my generation, but previous generations got here from somewhere else. Yeah. And I think that's what makes us so cool as a country, is having such a diverse group of people. If we can just get back to people having conversations about things they disagree with without getting mad, I would be much happier. Because we used to, you know, we could we could disagree on our politics or where whatever. It it it was just a conversation, you know, and there wasn't such angst behind it. I hope we can get back to that because when when when you I don't know how much traveling abroad you've done, but when I travel, I love to talk to the local people. I don't like to stay at a resort. I'd rather stay somewhere where, like, real life happens. We we stayed over in Algeria, a few years back in Africa, South America, Central America, all these places that I've been in my life. It's so freaking interesting to see how people live. And then when they get to immigrate here, you know, we get to bring a little bit of that. And, I just I think that's so cool. It is. Yeah. And, I mean, even with my parents to think how they grew up. I mean, my dad grew up in, like, a village in Italy, and they both came to the US, didn't speak any English, and just had to learn. I think they were around eighteen years old and had to learn and finish high school. And it's just it's really interesting. And I I like to do something similar when I'm travel traveling. This past summer, I went to Italy again to visit, and we did the Amalfi Coast. And so, you know, we stayed in Positano and Capri. But then we went to some smaller towns and just stayed in those that were very much remote, all locals. Oh my gosh. The food there, the culture there, it's just so night and day compared to the touristy areas. And Yeah. Yeah. For sure. That that's I really love doing that. I'm, we're due for a trip. We gotta we my wife and I, we gotta plan something. We you know, during COVID, we, we moved and went to Florida. We remodeled a house down there, and then we came back to the Carolinas. And, we've been tweaking on this house, you know, for a couple years. So we're ready for a trip somewhere fun. So we gotta we gotta get that scheduled so we can go immerse into something fun. Alright. So what is big on your horizon? Eight years I know you probably think, wow. It's been eight years already, but then some days you think, my god. It's been eight years. What's next on your horizon? Like, what do you see yourself? You're you're still young, but you have a a nice, you know, body of work already. After eight years of being there, worked yourself to a vice president position. What what do you see yourself blossoming further blossoming into? I teeter between different ideas. I mean, for this immediate year, I'd love to see how I can help continue to grow the agency. We've grown just this past year since I became VP, and I'd love to see us, you know, expand our clients, add some more PR associates. And I really wanna step more into that mentor position that Beth really gave to me. I love seeing that as I see it clicking with our new PR associate, Laura. As she's writing a pitch and we're coming up with ideas, I act I have a lot of fun training and building them up and learning more from that, you know, back and forth because they're also teaching me the newest things. It's funny how when I started this, everyone would look at me. I looked so young, and I was definitely the most expertise in social media and all of that stuff. And now we have these younger peer associates that are even more tech savvy, so I'm also learning from them as well, as much as they're learning from me. Bigger picture future, I don't know. I guess we'll have to wait and see if it's gonna look like my own agency or maybe a bigger step into, you know, something bigger. I don't know. Well, it's cool that you got, the the foundation there that you built to work off of. You know, owning your own firm is a is a whole different animal. Yeah. Because you get all these other, challenges that have zero to do with creative and everything to do with the with the business side of it, which you probably are already absorbing some of that as a VP. Yeah. And so that's also been the biggest part right now is where I'm I'm learning that whole side, and I'm way more hands on on that side. So right now, I'm still I'm still learning. I'm still growing and figuring out what that next big step is. But it's on the horizon, I think. Well, I love that. There's nothing like owning your own firm. I had the very fortunate pleasure of working for a large independent contractor, and then I started my own company and ran it for fifteen years, sold it to ServiceLogic where I work. I I wouldn't trade anything for it because I love the small business, and we had, you know, forty people. And but and but always seem to go together these days. It was hard, you know. It was it was difficult to run a really good company properly to and properly for me meant giving good benefits, everything we could give, you know, to take care of the folks who work there. But also having to balance that out with, okay, we still gotta make a living. You know? It's always a struggle. But, you know, now being sixty, and working for a large company that has given me the opportunity to be in a position to do what I really want to do, which is kind of why I started my company to begin with, was to help people and solve problems. I feel like I've come full circle to that. That's really rewarding. So, you know, there's several steps in the reward cycle, but you've got plenty of time to figure it out. But you'll do well whichever way. You've got you've got a natural spunk about you. Thank you. That that will that will take you a long way. Alright. So, I know we're getting, on our on our time here, but I wanted to ask you, because you you've been there eight years now, and you talk about the younger folks coming into the organization. I'm big on understanding multigenerational, interactions at at at offices or at companies. How have the the, I guess, the the receptors, the younger folks coming in, how have their expectations of what you're delivering changed from what Beth delivered to you eight years ago? Oh, it's how you know? Well, a lot has changed. I feel like I mean, even just takes the social media part of the business. Social media has become this huge component. I mean, it's always been huge, but the way the algorithms have changed and how organic social media marketing is just it's not the same. You kinda have to tie in and have that digital marketing side and the paid side. And video has become king and it's everything. Before you could you know, it was captioning was really important and a photo. But now we're it's just become so much more robust. And so all of that has trickled and changed. And I think just finding what I look for is, you know, we're finding people who are eager and are creative, kind of just go getters who wanna own whatever, you know, whether it's our social media expert on the team or if they're writing pitches, where they can just own it and be creative. One thing, Beth it's interesting because she was such a strong mentor, but at the same time, she was very hands off. She let me totally grow and speak my ideas in meetings and just gave me the floor. And so I love to do that do the same because I want to be building up these other confident I mean, we happen to be a whole group of women without, you know, even meaning to be. But we are a whole group of women in our agency. And so I just love building up this new generation of women the same that Beth did for me by letting them just be creative, tell their ideas, implement it, you know, to see how it works. And I feel like it's it's I mean, with our current team right now, it's very well received. And so yeah. That that that portion, I've kind of, like, taken inherited and have been passing down. So it's been going well. But with a little bit more focus and strategy because of all the, you know, the new hurdles for social and things like that that just weren't as tough back then. Mhmm. You know, you could put up organic social media posts and the algorithm, like, people would see it that we're following you. But now those things aren't being shown. And so there's a lot more strategy and planning that go into things like that. And so, of course, they need to be taught those strategies and how we research, conduct, write scripts, all that. But then I let them run free with the how Beth did for me with the creativity. Well, getting your own knees skinned is always good to a degree. Yeah. Because you you don't grow without scar tissue. But Yeah. And PR is not for someone who gets their feelings hurt easily because you're you know, we have to be able to take constructive constructive criticism internally between us if, you know, the ideas were bouncing, and then, of course, through the client. And if they're not liking it, and then let's say we launch it and the campaign just isn't a hit. I mean, that's also so there's a lot of that. And then on the pitching side too, like, you're just not every email is gonna get read. People aren't gonna like your pitch ideas, and so you just have to be able to take that feedback, build the relationships, and, just keep at it. Well, I'm a Kaizen practitioner, k a I z e n, and that means continuous improvement. And I find that's the only way to get better for me. You know? It works for me. You do it. You measure it. You tweak it. You do it. You measure it. You tweak it. That way you're not having to make these monumental shifts at any given time. Yeah. You may be one step behind, but you're not a mile behind. So you're always looking for ways of improvement and being nimble enough to do it quickly and on the fly. And that to me is such a healthy environment for me. I'm I'm I won't say it works for everybody because I don't know. But I I just I love that continuous, you know, always looking. Alright. How can we get better at this? What can we do better, quicker? You know, whatever the need is, but you have to stay on it. It it's not something it's like you can't read your company mission once a year and put it back on the shelf. You know, you have to live it. And if your job is to deliver great content to people, you have to do that every damn day. You have to get up and you go to work at it. You can't expect it to happen without scant knees every once in a while. So well, Samantha, by golly, this has been a good one. I love talking to you. I feel like we could go for three more hours, but you may send me an invoice. So I better better not push that. Likewise. But I really have, enjoyed our our our time. I'm I'm glad that whatever time it is in Phoenix, I'm glad that we were able to to connect today. I when we met and and we had our initial chat, I thought it would be fun for us to get together, and, I'm I'm proud to say I was right. So this has been fun for me. I hope you've gotten a little bit of creative juices flowing where you can get back on your keyboard and pound out the next winning, you know, award winning pitch. So No. Thank you. Yes. This was it was a lot of fun. I'm glad I'm glad we did it too. Well, folks, I hope y'all enjoyed talking to Samantha DeRozes. You can find her on LinkedIn. You can find her, probably on Instagram, basically, find what she said a while ago. And you can find her at the McCray Agency located in beautiful Tippie, Arizona. So, thank you all for taking time out of your lives to listen to us for almost an hour. Could've gone longer, but I'm, I've got stuff to do. I know Samantha's got a list of stuff to do. You all have plenty to do too while you're out there driving around or whatever you're doing today listening to this. But, please, if you want some more, go go to greg crumpton dot com. Click on the podcast tab. You can get a hundred and thirty something, episodes. Something will tickle your fancy, hopefully. We work hard to bring you a diverse group of of folks to talk with so that we don't get stale, and and we try to learn as we go. But you can find it Apple, Spotify, just about anywhere. Look for Straight Out of Crumpton. And, let me get my ten percent in here, Samantha. Please go to gregcrumpton dot com or deepknowledge. Me, and you can pick up your copy of, Deep Knowledge the Book in Barnes and Noble, and or Amazon. We'll ship it directly to your house. Hope you can get something out of that. And if you order today, you can still get it for Christmas, I'm told. So, no guarantee on that. For Samantha DeRose, I'm Greg Crumpton. Happy Holidays to you guys and we look forward to talking to you soon.